Comments on: China and India: The Power of Two http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/ The MBA Graduate Program at Cal Poly Fri, 18 May 2012 15:52:13 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.3 By: Chris Phippen http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-18000 Chris Phippen Fri, 19 Mar 2010 22:42:36 +0000 http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-18000 I'm in agreement with many others above. The U.S. should indeed take note and learn from the border policies of other countries. However, the two situations could not be more different. India and China have complimentary traits. How exactly do the U.S. and Mexico compliment each other? In the India-China situation, there are scores of educated, English-speaking, technically literate workers being shared. Is the population of Mexican immigrants largely comprised of such workers? I do see the value in a certain amount of workers coming from Mexico, coming from an agricultural background, but we are also dealing with a population/illegal immigration issue here in the U.S. The border issue in the U.S. also raises the sensitive issue of national security. I'm not well-read on the security concerns of India or China, but I know we have some legitimate concerns on the subject here in the U.S. Also, in what ways can the U.S. contribute to Mexico if such symbiosis was to take place? Any thoughts? I’m in agreement with many others above. The U.S. should indeed take note and learn from the border policies of other countries. However, the two situations could not be more different. India and China have complimentary traits. How exactly do the U.S. and Mexico compliment each other? In the India-China situation, there are scores of educated, English-speaking, technically literate workers being shared. Is the population of Mexican immigrants largely comprised of such workers? I do see the value in a certain amount of workers coming from Mexico, coming from an agricultural background, but we are also dealing with a population/illegal immigration issue here in the U.S. The border issue in the U.S. also raises the sensitive issue of national security. I’m not well-read on the security concerns of India or China, but I know we have some legitimate concerns on the subject here in the U.S.

Also, in what ways can the U.S. contribute to Mexico if such symbiosis was to take place? Any thoughts?

]]> By: Jordan Wente http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-17850 Jordan Wente Mon, 15 Mar 2010 02:03:44 +0000 http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-17850 China and India may be cooperating with each other now but will this really last? The reason for this cooperation is due to the two different paths of development that currently complement each other. As both countries continue to develop, I see the relationship between the two becoming increasingly tense. Right now India is not able to be as competitive in manufacturing due to restrictions created as a result of lack of infrastructure. Once infrastructure is in place that will enable India to compete with China’s manufacturing capabilities, I can’t imagine that the two will be as cooperative. There are many other factors that could cause friction between the two countries. They might be working together now on acquiring energy resources but as these resources become more scarce and demand for them in each country continues to grow I would imagine that will place a major strain on the relationship. Additionally, political differences between the two countries have the possibility to create tension. We also have to consider that at the moment border relations are not a main priority for India and China. The focus for both is economic development not border control. Thus, as long as they are cooperating with each other and not creating problems that might halt either ones plans for economic growth, this issue is on the back burner. It will be interesting to see how their relationships evolve over time. It’s great that the two countries are collaborating and utilizing each other’s strengths to further their goals for expansion. This is defiantly something the US should learn from. However, I think the situation between Mexico and the United States is quite different from that of India and China. I agree with many of you that they are just in different stages and shouldn’t be compared to India and China. China and India may be cooperating with each other now but will this really last? The reason for this cooperation is due to the two different paths of development that currently complement each other. As both countries continue to develop, I see the relationship between the two becoming increasingly tense. Right now India is not able to be as competitive in manufacturing due to restrictions created as a result of lack of infrastructure. Once infrastructure is in place that will enable India to compete with China’s manufacturing capabilities, I can’t imagine that the two will be as cooperative.

There are many other factors that could cause friction between the two countries. They might be working together now on acquiring energy resources but as these resources become more scarce and demand for them in each country continues to grow I would imagine that will place a major strain on the relationship. Additionally, political differences between the two countries have the possibility to create tension. We also have to consider that at the moment border relations are not a main priority for India and China. The focus for both is economic development not border control. Thus, as long as they are cooperating with each other and not creating problems that might halt either ones plans for economic growth, this issue is on the back burner. It will be interesting to see how their relationships evolve over time.

It’s great that the two countries are collaborating and utilizing each other’s strengths to further their goals for expansion. This is defiantly something the US should learn from. However, I think the situation between Mexico and the United States is quite different from that of India and China. I agree with many of you that they are just in different stages and shouldn’t be compared to India and China.

]]> By: Frederick Peemoeller http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-17817 Frederick Peemoeller Sat, 13 Mar 2010 00:06:36 +0000 http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-17817 Rather than show our closed border with Mexico, I think in this context you should show our open border with Canada. This makes more sense since both the USA and Canada are at the same level of economic and government stability. Mexico, on the other hand, is a country with so many resources but a horrible infrastructure. It is most definitely a step below its neighboring northern countries. China and India both are emerging at the same time. They compliment each other well and their cohesiveness has definitely helped their growth. I will say that our cohesiveness with Canada has also provided similar benefits. We send thousands of senior citizens up there to get cheap drugs, and we reap the benefits of their large oil reserves. This shows that we do have more similarities between our neighbor than one may think. Rather than show our closed border with Mexico, I think in this context you should show our open border with Canada. This makes more sense since both the USA and Canada are at the same level of economic and government stability. Mexico, on the other hand, is a country with so many resources but a horrible infrastructure. It is most definitely a step below its neighboring northern countries.

China and India both are emerging at the same time. They compliment each other well and their cohesiveness has definitely helped their growth. I will say that our cohesiveness with Canada has also provided similar benefits. We send thousands of senior citizens up there to get cheap drugs, and we reap the benefits of their large oil reserves. This shows that we do have more similarities between our neighbor than one may think.

]]> By: Yuxiang Gao http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-17734 Yuxiang Gao Mon, 08 Mar 2010 19:10:47 +0000 http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-17734 The simultaneous emergence into the global economy of two countries containing nearly two-fifths of the world’s people is after all an unprecedented phenomenon. Moreover, China’s dominance of global manufacturing seems matched by India’s arrival as an important provider of information-technology and other services. Zhu Rongji, a former Chinese prime minister said: “You are number one in software. We are number one in hardware…Together we are the world’s number one.” That is India’s misfortune. Hundreds of thousands of Indians work in IT services whereas manufacturing for export provides China with tens of millions of jobs. It is interesting to see that the history always repeat the same story. Hundreds years ago, China was the biggest economy in the world. Then the government tried to close our borders to protect us at a time when so much of the world is opening up to the possibilities of technology and that’s the begging of the decomposing. Now as what mentioned in the article, some Americans are trying to do the same thing. But in my opinion, though the situation in the USA is similar but also different, the main concern is over protecting and enforcing legal trade and legal immigration. Illegal immigration costs taxpayers millions of dollars each year in unpaid taxes, hospital bills, education and many other areas. The simultaneous emergence into the global economy of two countries containing nearly two-fifths of the world’s people is after all an unprecedented phenomenon. Moreover, China’s dominance of global manufacturing seems matched by India’s arrival as an important provider of information-technology and other services.
Zhu Rongji, a former Chinese prime minister said: “You are number one in software. We are number one in hardware…Together we are the world’s number one.” That is India’s misfortune. Hundreds of thousands of Indians work in IT services whereas manufacturing for export provides China with tens of millions of jobs.
It is interesting to see that the history always repeat the same story. Hundreds years ago, China was the biggest economy in the world. Then the government tried to close our borders to protect us at a time when so much of the world is opening up to the possibilities of technology and that’s the begging of the decomposing.
Now as what mentioned in the article, some Americans are trying to do the same thing.
But in my opinion, though the situation in the USA is similar but also different, the main concern is over protecting and enforcing legal trade and legal immigration. Illegal immigration costs taxpayers millions of dollars each year in unpaid taxes, hospital bills, education and many other areas.

]]> By: Michael Minasian http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-17712 Michael Minasian Sat, 06 Mar 2010 10:50:58 +0000 http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-17712 Echoing on what many have said above, I think that it is both unfair and unwise to compare the US/Mexico border with the India / China border. The reason for building a wall between the US and mexico may have symbolic implications economically, but the point of it is for security reasons. The economic implications for massive immigration come in the form of social services. The problem that our border faces are just different from the other border situation. As far as I can tell there aren't masses of Indian's who want to immigrate to China or vice versa. I also find it funny as someone pointed out above that many of the elitist European nations who condemn every move the US makes, have much stricter rules in place of their own. They certainly wouldn't put up with millions of undocumented additional people in their countries. Some do, many don't. Echoing on what many have said above, I think that it is both unfair and unwise to compare the US/Mexico border with the India / China border. The reason for building a wall between the US and mexico may have symbolic implications economically, but the point of it is for security reasons. The economic implications for massive immigration come in the form of social services. The problem that our border faces are just different from the other border situation. As far as I can tell there aren’t masses of Indian’s who want to immigrate to China or vice versa. I also find it funny as someone pointed out above that many of the elitist European nations who condemn every move the US makes, have much stricter rules in place of their own. They certainly wouldn’t put up with millions of undocumented additional people in their countries. Some do, many don’t.

]]> By: Catherine Kristensen http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-17623 Catherine Kristensen Tue, 23 Feb 2010 04:57:55 +0000 http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-17623 It is very interesting to contrast these two sets of neighbors (Mexico/US & China/India). Collaboration, trade and resources are the first few factors that come to mind when I think of how neighboring countries can be analyzed. When countries are more like peers and on level-playing fields, it seems that there is more potential for collaboration. I see this as the possibility for China and India. They are both in a phase of major growth and that commonality lends itself well to developing policies designed for the collective. Mexico and the US, on the other hand, are not likely to be viewed as peers. We've got the Pacific Ocean in common, but that is about where the threads of similarity end. When one government is providing resources, especially education or health care, to their citizens, outsiders are willing to take major risks, however illegal, including human smuggling, to take part in those activities. What a different situation this would be if the Mexicans that wanted to be in the US had similarity to the "tens of thousands of technically sophisticated, English-speaking graduates" of India. I think the emphasis on a wall dividing Mexico and the US would change drastically if that was the case... It is very interesting to contrast these two sets of neighbors (Mexico/US & China/India). Collaboration, trade and resources are the first few factors that come to mind when I think of how neighboring countries can be analyzed.

When countries are more like peers and on level-playing fields, it seems that there is more potential for collaboration. I see this as the possibility for China and India. They are both in a phase of major growth and that commonality lends itself well to developing policies designed for the collective.

Mexico and the US, on the other hand, are not likely to be viewed as peers. We’ve got the Pacific Ocean in common, but that is about where the threads of similarity end. When one government is providing resources, especially education or health care, to their citizens, outsiders are willing to take major risks, however illegal, including human smuggling, to take part in those activities.

What a different situation this would be if the Mexicans that wanted to be in the US had similarity to the “tens of thousands of technically sophisticated, English-speaking graduates” of India. I think the emphasis on a wall dividing Mexico and the US would change drastically if that was the case…

]]> By: John Barry http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-17609 John Barry Mon, 22 Feb 2010 04:38:54 +0000 http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-17609 While China and India may have found a mutually beneficial relationship from working with each other does not mean that the same could be said of other nations in completely different circumstances. Furthermore, the article cited speaks of international trade, something the United States does conduct a fair amount of with Mexico. The closing of the border has to do with keeping illegal immigration down. Unfortunately for the American economy and Americans alike, it is not the most highly educated and innovative members of Mexican society who enter the country illegally though Texas, Arizona, and California. Instead it is those whose qualifications keep them from thriving in their own nation. While they may in fact contribute a fair amount to their employers here in America, the fact that they are willing to work for wages far lower than those expected by their American counterparts has dessimated the American middle class, while increasing the number of poverty level Americans, and also increasing the net worth of those illegally hiring these unregistered workers. While China and India may have found a mutually beneficial relationship from working with each other does not mean that the same could be said of other nations in completely different circumstances. Furthermore, the article cited speaks of international trade, something the United States does conduct a fair amount of with Mexico.

The closing of the border has to do with keeping illegal immigration down. Unfortunately for the American economy and Americans alike, it is not the most highly educated and innovative members of Mexican society who enter the country illegally though Texas, Arizona, and California. Instead it is those whose qualifications keep them from thriving in their own nation. While they may in fact contribute a fair amount to their employers here in America, the fact that they are willing to work for wages far lower than those expected by their American counterparts has dessimated the American middle class, while increasing the number of poverty level Americans, and also increasing the net worth of those illegally hiring these unregistered workers.

]]> By: Erika Bylund http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-17564 Erika Bylund Wed, 17 Feb 2010 23:01:39 +0000 http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-17564 Jason brings up a good point in his comment. When there is a huge asymmetry in the immigration trends between neighboring countries, there is a cause for concern. The pros and cons of Mexican-American immigration policy are well-known and hotly debated. But for the first time (between 2008 and 2009), California has actually seen an outflow of immigrants from the state back to Mexico. To be clear, the U.S. has not closed its borders to Mexico. And I think it's easy to lose sight of that fact. The U.S. has become more stringent in its immigration policies and procedures and has reduced the number of visas and green cards it issues annually, but the borders are still open, freely, to those who follow procedure and meet the requirements. I've heard many complain about how stringent American immigration requirements are, but the U.S. is not alone. Many European countries, like Holland, also have "impossible" entrance requirements. It is important to share opportunity with those who want it, but not to the detriment of the current citizens. Also, the blog author insinuates that there are more pressing disputes to deal with than the border issues, pointing to the fact that China and India spend a lot of energy making sure their constituents can eat and have jobs. Well, what happens after you make it to that point? The U.S. is at a totally different point in its development than China and India. Rather than make the analogy that the U.S. is like a "teenager within the context of world history" I would argue that a better analogy is that the U.S. is like a mature company in the industry- large in size, producing stable returns, and relatively rigid in terms of innovation. India and China would be in the growth stage- volatile and uncertain with the potential for huge growth and the ability to become the new industry leader if it can make it past this first critical stage. Jason brings up a good point in his comment. When there is a huge asymmetry in the immigration trends between neighboring countries, there is a cause for concern. The pros and cons of Mexican-American immigration policy are well-known and hotly debated. But for the first time (between 2008 and 2009), California has actually seen an outflow of immigrants from the state back to Mexico.

To be clear, the U.S. has not closed its borders to Mexico. And I think it’s easy to lose sight of that fact. The U.S. has become more stringent in its immigration policies and procedures and has reduced the number of visas and green cards it issues annually, but the borders are still open, freely, to those who follow procedure and meet the requirements. I’ve heard many complain about how stringent American immigration requirements are, but the U.S. is not alone. Many European countries, like Holland, also have “impossible” entrance requirements. It is important to share opportunity with those who want it, but not to the detriment of the current citizens.

Also, the blog author insinuates that there are more pressing disputes to deal with than the border issues, pointing to the fact that China and India spend a lot of energy making sure their constituents can eat and have jobs. Well, what happens after you make it to that point? The U.S. is at a totally different point in its development than China and India. Rather than make the analogy that the U.S. is like a “teenager within the context of world history” I would argue that a better analogy is that the U.S. is like a mature company in the industry- large in size, producing stable returns, and relatively rigid in terms of innovation. India and China would be in the growth stage- volatile and uncertain with the potential for huge growth and the ability to become the new industry leader if it can make it past this first critical stage.

]]> By: Jason Silver http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-17512 Jason Silver Thu, 11 Feb 2010 05:39:57 +0000 http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-17512 The border dispute between China and India can be compared only in terms of geographic proximity. The intensity of this border dispute could only be helped by the fact that both countries are experiencing economic growth above 7% annually. Therefore there is no massive effort of one countries population to move to its neighboring country in search of prospective economic advantages. Mexico is experiencing economic growth of 1.3% annually and shows no real sign of increasing that number. American GDP decreased in 2009 by 2.4%, suffering a hangover from the worst economic depression in decades, yet the allure of "The American Dream" remains strong. It will interesting to see how China and India's relationship persists. As for America and Mexico, I do not think the two neighbors will be opening up the borders any time soon. The border dispute between China and India can be compared only in terms of geographic proximity. The intensity of this border dispute could only be helped by the fact that both countries are experiencing economic growth above 7% annually. Therefore there is no massive effort of one countries population to move to its neighboring country in search of prospective economic advantages.

Mexico is experiencing economic growth of 1.3% annually and shows no real sign of increasing that number. American GDP decreased in 2009 by 2.4%, suffering a hangover from the worst economic depression in decades, yet the allure of “The American Dream” remains strong.

It will interesting to see how China and India’s relationship persists. As for America and Mexico, I do not think the two neighbors will be opening up the borders any time soon.

]]> By: Phil Hamer http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-17449 Phil Hamer Sun, 24 Jan 2010 18:38:40 +0000 http://calpolymbatrip.com/2007/china/china-and-india-the-power-of-two/#comment-17449 It is not hard to control a border when you have an enormous mountain range and poverty on both sides of that border. Almost all the wealth in China lies on the Eastern side. If Shanghai were bordering India rather than Tibet, it would be a much different story. The fact that Tibet is the bordering land is another thing to take into consideration. India has much sympathy for the plight of the Tibetans. They have granted land to thousands and thousands of Tibetan refugees and have given the Dalai Lama a place to live and rule. This has been a strain on India and China relations. Since this article was posted there have also been other border disputes with China and India. In fact, just a couple months ago there was an <a href="http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125625173429702481.html" rel="nofollow"> article in the Wall Street Journal</a> that told of Chinese soldiers bullying Indian Nomads in disputed territories. Who's being juvenile now? Both countries are 5,000 years old and they don't even know where their borders are! Along the borders are lands claimed by China and controlled by India and vise-versa. China makes it difficult for their own people to immigrate from one province to another even within their own country borders. I'm sure if they were faced with the same illegal immigration problems that our country is, things would be much different. It is not hard to control a border when you have an enormous mountain range and poverty on both sides of that border. Almost all the wealth in China lies on the Eastern side. If Shanghai were bordering India rather than Tibet, it would be a much different story.

The fact that Tibet is the bordering land is another thing to take into consideration. India has much sympathy for the plight of the Tibetans. They have granted land to thousands and thousands of Tibetan refugees and have given the Dalai Lama a place to live and rule. This has been a strain on India and China relations.

Since this article was posted there have also been other border disputes with China and India. In fact, just a couple months ago there was an article in the Wall Street Journal that told of Chinese soldiers bullying Indian Nomads in disputed territories. Who’s being juvenile now? Both countries are 5,000 years old and they don’t even know where their borders are! Along the borders are lands claimed by China and controlled by India and vise-versa.

China makes it difficult for their own people to immigrate from one province to another even within their own country borders. I’m sure if they were faced with the same illegal immigration problems that our country is, things would be much different.

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