Confucious Says ‘Listen, Look and Learn’
January 30th, 2007
Below are excerpts from two wonderful posts on the One Man Bandwidth blog (click here and here or the full posts). Lonnie is an American who has lived in China for 17 years. You will meet him in Guangzhou.
[General Musings]
“[Though they have moved Westward] the Chinese are still generally shy about public discussions of sex and public displays of affection. Hugging someone or asking about sensitive issues might evoke giggling or laughter. The Chinese often respond to social discomfort by laughing.
Do not take their seeming amusement as encouragement. They are telling you they don’t feel comfortable, so don’t push on. The Chinese have long memories and it could cause them to avoid certain kinds of contact with you in the future. Other conversational minefields:
–While it is common to talk about a person’s background or family in China, it is rare to hear someone discuss their spouse or significant other. It is entirely possible that you will attend several social gatherings over several months and not know that your colleague is married or in a relationship.
– Salary and money issues are usually off-limits. The Cantonese seem to feel no fear about asking about a person’s wages or the cost of something they own or wear, but it is best to avoid the subject in young relationships. Normal salaries in Guangzhou can be between $50-400 a month, so don’t put colleagues or friends in a position to be embarrassed when compared to you or the west.
– Don’t ask a woman in her late twenties if she is married. It is a cultural expectation that they will be married by that time, so you could really embarrass her. And don’t expect them to understand why many Americans practice serial monogamy before settling down. Many Chinese have had only one mate since junior high school or college.
– Stay away from religion and politics in dialogue. Most Chinese have no concept of religion, though many are quite superstitious, and the wrong politics can end your advancement in a job setting or worse. It will be a long time before you get anything but party-line answers to questions on Tibet, Tiananmen, Taiwan and so on. Many will not answer you because they just don’t have a lot to share. The news is controlled and bringing up a topic like the role of the new Pope might get you blank stares–like I did when I mentioned it in class as a daily news item. Because of the long-standing rift with the Vatican, Chinese news devoted a total of seventeen seconds of national television to Pope John Paul II’s death.
DO ask about holidays, customs, history and business. And when you do, listen and learn. You are not going to change mindsets by being argumentative. Find out more about how and why the Chinese think the way they do before you attempt to change it. Where some westerners enjoy a lively debate or discussion it may seem to some Chinese that you are angry or oppositional and that will drop you several rungs down the ladder of esteem.
Don’t be “a crane standing among chickens.” There is much to enjoy in interpersonal exchanges if you are open and receptive.
[Creativity and Innovation]
Chinese approaches to problem solving can frustrate the newcomer especially if he/she is called on to lead a team of Chinese nationals. When Chinese students and business managers run up against an obstacle they often just yield to it.
If the Great Wall were encountered by a group of Chinese collegians they would starve to death while forming committees on how to scale it, hurdle it, live on the student side of it or while waiting for their envoy, sent to fetch a projector so they could do a PowerPoint presentation on alternatives, to return. The Wall must have been more to keep Chinese in than Mongols out because when Ghengis Khan encountered it as an obstacle to the siege of Beijing he used the simplest of solutions: He went around it.
In an article in The Economists View I found this: “… Harry Shum, a Carnegie Mellon-trained computer engineer … said: ‘A Chinese journalist once asked me, ‘…what is the difference between China and the U.S.’ I joked, ‘… the difference between China high-tech and American high-tech is only three months - if you don’t count creativity.’”
The Chinese, and Japanese, are masters of the knock-off and can often de-bug new inventions faster than the original designers. But, the Chinese, who believe that that the proverbial nail that stands above the others is struck down, are not yet keen innovators.
Mind you, that is not all bad: Sony was created on the West’s sale of the transistor to Japan. They magnified our creative tremor into a multi-billion dollar tsunami of electronics products.
The Chinese educational system is the precursor for this seeming national inventor’s block. Chinese methodology often instructs students in classrooms deliberately shorted of resources in order to foster group cooperation, sharing and cohesiveness, not individual imagination.
One group of educators from South Carolina reported on a visit to China and mused over how they ordinarily would expect to “… see a classroom that invites children to choose what they want to do, and to work individually in centers, using materials in individualistic and creative ways. Here we saw evidence that teachers expected conformity and a willingness to work toward the completion of a task the chosen by the teacher rather than the child. These contrasting instructional styles highlight an important difference between the Eastern culture that expects citizens to adapt to their environment and Western ones where the social system stresses freedom, self-expression, and self determination.”
And the Chinese style of University teaching is a true marvel: If they banned PowerPoint in Chinese Colleges half of my colleagues would be stuck dumb. They would panic at the thought of delivering a lecture that diverged from main topic headings and bullet points. The only thing worse would be to have to spontaneously entertain questions from the class. Of course the class would be just as terrified about having to invent queries; hence, foreign teachers who teach without clear guides evident to students may be regarded as unorganized or inept.
A government sponsored study done in 2000 showed that only 14.9 percent Chinese youth polled believed they had creative ability; so, do not be surprised when students, friends or co-workers balk at having to tackle a problem without a clear solution. Do not be shocked when they hover around you for answers to difficult problems.
The survey mentioned above also indicated that 60 percent of the youngsters polled recognized the importance of creativity and 65.3 percent have curiosity about the world around them. Consequently, the government is studying ways to break the PowerPoint habit and circumvent the wall. When they do, the economic race will really be on.
Now, if we could just get American kids to do math ….”
Lonnie, you are the man.
Entry Filed under: Pre-Departure, China, Misc., Post Trip Wrap-Up re: China
9 Comments Add your own
1. Felipe Hernandez | January 30th, 2007 at 11:00 am
Speaking of Lonnie, I was just reading One Man Bandwith and I don’t think I’ve laughed so hard in months. The post about the Star Wars english translation is hysterical - “I was just made by the Presbytarian Church.”
I would love to bring one of these things back for the humor and souvenir value, but he mentions that a friend was fined $2000 for trying to bring a DVD into Australia. Is it common to get caught for such an offense and are the fines always as severe?
Also, it sounds as if these translations are loaded with anti-west propaganda i.e. - the westerners are associated as the bad guys. Is that to appease the government or is that simply how the Chinese citizens/filmmakers view things?
Anyway, great stuff - One Man Bandwith is now in my bookmarks.
2. Chris Carr | January 30th, 2007 at 11:06 am
Let’s discuss Felipe’s first question in one of our Spring predeparture sessions.
In the meantime, Lonnie, your thoughts?
3. Erik | January 30th, 2007 at 1:04 pm
In reading these excerpts I kept being struck with the idea that while there are numerous differences, there are also many similarities between our cultures/societies. By no means am I trying to discount what Lonnie has written - he clearly has the experience and background to make these assertions, but let me compile a list of similarities using his list of differences as a base:
[General Musings]
1. Many Americans (my wife included) giggle when nervous.
2. Salary and money issues are usually off-limits for Americans - I wouldn’t feel comfortable disclosing my salary to many people.
3. Stay away from religion and politics in dialogue - I’ve got to believe this advice is global.
4. Americans generally enjoy talking about themselves - their holidays, customs, business. Also, Americans don’t like to be told how to think.
[Creativity and Innovation]
5. If you put a group of 100 American college professors together to determine how to teach a class, you’d have 100 different opinions - many of them vocalized over a powerpoint presentation.
6. When I was an undergrad (roughly 15-20 years ago), we did virtually NO group work. Now, undergrad students spend a bulk of their college career in groups with the desired goal of these students being cooperative, cohesive, and collaborative.
7. Other students can chime in, but how many professors have you had in your student career who have a “set” lecture with little to no deviation? My guess is that the number is too high.
4. Lonnie | January 30th, 2007 at 4:37 pm
Hi all…I just dropped in for a second, but will answer your questions toonight…
One the face of it, yes, the similarities are many, but I will detail the nuances. Sometimes I dabble in a bit of subjective shorthand because I am TOO familiar with the subjecta AND to keep the censors off my blog…
Thanks Chris!
Lon
5. Lonnie | January 31st, 2007 at 3:58 am
This is meant only to clarify, nit to be agumentative….I am certainly not the cross-legged guy on the mountain top with all the China answers….
(http://www.onemanbandwidth.com/wordpress/?p=773)
1. Many Americans (my wife included) giggle when nervous.
It is a matter of degrees and our interpretation. A giggle here is usually a signal to you to back off. They do not push the limits as we are oft to do…
2. Salary and money issues are usually off-limits for Americans - I wouldn’t feel comfortable disclosing my salary to many people.
The reason for this is not that is a personal issue, but more because you run the risk of embarassing someone who only makes 5% of what you do. I know Chinese people who make less than $50 USD a month. In keeping with this you should not act surprised that someone has not had an experience or used a device. They probably can’t afford it. They ask each other all the time about money, but, you should not. unless you are sure it is a safe subject. Surprisingly, the poorer Chinese will be more apt to tell you…
3. Stay away from religion and politics in dialogue - I’ve got to believe this advice is global.
The differnce is simple: it is often against the law and DEFINITELY against contract rules to do so if you are a foreign expert in China. They will get wide-eyed at any comments about Taiwan, religion, or Tibet and may avoid you for future discussions.
4. Americans generally enjoy talking about themselves - their holidays, customs, business. Also, Americans don’t like to be told how to think.
Chinese will invariably default to easy subjects as they are no comfortable being visible. They are taught that the peg that sticks up gets beaten down. They will head for benign subjects and hope you take the heat off of them. Chinese are glad to be told what to think if it means they don’t have to do so in certain situations where they could lose face.
[Creativity and Innovation]
5. If you put a group of 100 American college professors together to determine how to teach a class, you’d have 100 different opinions - many of them vocalized over a powerpoint presentation.
Here you would have a couple of State approved opinions ALL done on PowerPoint. I loathe PowerPoint.
6. When I was an undergrad (roughly 15-20 years ago), we did virtually NO group work. Now, undergrad students spend a bulk of their college career in groups with the desired goal of these students being cooperative, cohesive, and collaborative.
Team building and forced cooperation are not the same. Dave Barry mused about the Japanese that it would be easier to get the whole of Tokyo to wear the same outfit on the same day than to get two Americans to agree on what to bring to a barbecue. Group leaders in China are generally appointed and follow party orders and rarely advocate for the group. They are an instrument of the institution rather than a guiding force. Groups rarely act as a unit themselves to effect change as we do. Many student groups wil have the same or similar personalities.
7. Other students can chime in, but how many professors have you had in your student career who have a “set” lecture with little to no deviation? My guess is that the number is too high.
It is not at all uncommon to see a professor here reading aloud from a book while seated. I have seen up to half of a class sound asleep during a “lecture” and with good reason. A teacher like that at Cal Poly better have tenure…We all do canned presentations, but rarely teach only what is in the book or on a slide show.
You will get to see it first-hand here, I hope. Come as a blank slate to China without trying to minimize or exaggerate differences. You will be richer for it…
You guys are going to have a blast!
P.S.:
Um, on the DVD thing…I can point you to a couple of Video Speakeasy Joints…
I know lots of people that bring them back without incident, but….Um, you could claim you were returning them because they said “Property of Touchstone Pictures” all through the flick…:-)
Sorry about the horrible typing in my first answer…
Lon
.
..
6. Erik | January 31st, 2007 at 7:19 am
Lonnie-
Thanks for providing clarification. It’s smart for us to be aware of cultural differences that could prove to be embarrassing for either ourselves or our hosts. I hope between now and June we have further blog discussions similar to this to continue to raise our collective awareness.
I went to the Soviet Union in 1986 as part of a student group - this was still during the cold war. Our countries were very much enemies, but whenever we had the opportunity to talk to your run-of-the-mill citizen on the street, it was clear that although we came from very different backgrounds, we also had many similarities. It was a powerful experience for a 16 year old and one that has always encouraged me to find common ground with folks from different backgrounds.
Thanks again for your posts to this blog.
-Erik
7. Chris Carr | January 31st, 2007 at 9:27 am
Great stuff and nuances, Lonnie. Thanks for taking the time to share this info.
8. VIctoria Whelan | January 31st, 2007 at 1:15 pm
I find it interesting how our two cultures are so different, yet they are becoming similar to us in the business world and surpassing on us many things (technology). They also idolize a lot of our culture, like LEVI jeans and many food chains. I look forward to seeing how their culture changes as their business world grows.
At one time we did not allow women to be CFO, only domesticated roles. Politics and religion have always been a hush topic in our society, but more and more people are discussing these topics as the days progress. Actors and political figures are opening up, in hopes to have our society not be scared to discuss these issues. Maybe in the future, sooner rather than later, the Chinese will adapt more to the way our society acts.
9. David Zarcone | January 30th, 2008 at 3:40 pm
I find it extremely scary to think that suicide rates can be this high in any part of the world. Since I have been lived a rather comfortable life I feel so ignorant and blessed at the same time. The fact that in this certain farming region (Vidarbha) there is a suicide every eight hours due to their extreme debt that these people are forced to face is just depressing. The subsidized cotton in other countries forces farmers to reduce prices below their living requirements; something needs to change to improve this situation.
Leave a Comment
Some HTML allowed:
<a href="" title=""> <abbr title=""> <acronym title=""> <b> <blockquote cite=""> <cite> <code> <del datetime=""> <em> <i> <q cite=""> <strike> <strong>
Subscribe to the comments via RSS Feed